Discussing Healthcare and Rights

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I used this meme back last year in a post on whether people have a right to healthcare or not. Of course, I argued that people did not, as it does not naturally exist, and is the produc of other people’s labor. Still, many think they’re entitled to it, and for free as well. Recently, I responded to a few comments on this, and I will go ahead and post those below.

The first set are the criticisms that the Rand Paul argument received:

#1 – officermilky

Call me naive, but wouldn’t he be paid through taxes? He wouldn’t be working for free. The argument to that, of course, would be “robbing peter to pay paul” but healthcare would be taxes that, you know, a society would all agree to go in on because they democratically believe it’s the right thing to do?

I’m not even saying that’s a perfect solution to everything, but the Rand caption seems faulty.

#2 – ramblingferret

Yes just like in Canada and Europe we round up doctors and force them to work against there will. Like my poor shrink who works 8-5 with Wednesdays off.

#3 – sweertomato

And now, here is how I responded to each one of them:

@officermilky He would be paid under a market wage that he would have regularly earned, due to government price setting (both on goods and wages). Your main mistake is that you will not have all of society agreeing to this universal healthcare plan. You would only need 50% +1 to make this happen, and that doesn’t sound in any way like it “society would all agree to go in” with this, as you say. THAT WOULD BE THE CASE.

@ramblingferret You mention Canada’s system, and I’d be a bit careful with that. They tried to first off ban private insurance, which was ruled unconstitutional. Canadian healthcare wait times are far longer than American wait times.

canada healthcare times

In addition to this, Canada’s system is lagging in adopting to new technology and practices to improve the quality and speed of care. And I’d be even more careful to use Canada’s system, since it’s projected to eat up 97% of government revenues over time. If that’s something America should copy, I’d be skeptical. And if you still don’t believe I should be skeptical, I would ask the 40,000+ Canadians who sought medical treatment outside Canada due to these problems, and more.

@sweer-tomato You mention that it would be free. About that…

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And if that is the route you wish to take (in saying that universal healthcare is free), then this also applies:

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Weird how neither me nor Rand actually said the “ and saying oh “Survival of the fittest” if you get seriously ill / injured you deserve to die is the most barbaric and jackass thing you can say.” I honestly wonder where this even comes from, but I don’t think I care.

Now, under the current ACA, quality of care has gone down, and prices have gone up (especially when you’re not subsidised, like regular people with their own healthcare or through their business). Under the universal system, the costs become simply unseen by the everyday taxpayer, but is still felt on April 15, and don’t think for a second this is going to be in any way cheap, especially for people who are poor or have pre-existing conditions. Not when the plan require a bunch of crap that a) shouldnt be part of health insurance, and b) is mandated by government fiat.

And let’s chat about government mandated bull. I’ve yet to hear someone explain logically how the government can require health insurers to cover something, and the health insurers won’t raise their prices. The health insurers know they can simply jack up their prices all they want, because it’s now mandated that “x” service be covered. You wanna know why healthcare costs keep going up? It ain’t corporate greed that is the main problem. I’ll tell you that.

And let’s talk about 2016. If you’d like to see more poor people, go ahead, enact your universal healhcare system. Bernie’s plan sure ain’t cheap, since you’d have to come up with $3.2 trillion in new tax revenue per year (equalling $32 trillion in total, more than his original projections were) over the next decade to pay for just the healthcare costs. Since the Sander’s plan already boasts of tax hikes on the wealthy (aka the one’s who currently pay the majority of taxes), where is the rest of the money coming from? Hint hint, he will HAVE look lower. But don’t worry, you might be audited by the IRS after not paying taxes because you can’t afford them, but you’ll have healthcare still… that is, as long as they haven’t cut you off.

It’s 2016: let people actually keep their money for a change and get the damn government out of healthcare, so people can afford it and not go broke should something bad happen.


All in all, I haven’t done a good rebuttal like this in a while, and I probably could have done tons better, but this still came out good, and still hasn’t been rebutted by any of these three posters. I’m not expecting it to, but hey, we shall see.

The Similarities Between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton

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Donald Trump & Hillary Clinton: these two clowns are going to be their parties nominee’s for President, and since no one is left on the Republican side, and Bernie’s chances have evaporated on the Democrat side, there is little hope for anything different at this point. In this post, I will be going over some pretty interesting similarities between the two parties presumptive nominee’s, to show you that these two aren’t really much different.

#1. Healthcare

Both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump believe that everyone should have healthcare, a fallacy and utopian ideal in reality. This has also been seen in his fairly recent support for Universal Healthcare, which is contradictory to his healthcare plan released by his campaign. And furthermore, his healthcare plan has no mention of even trying to deal with the FDA and it’s effects on the pricing of new and general prescription drugs entering or already on the market, which he should have covered, seeing as how it’s a part of the reason why healthcare costs are rising. At least Hillary Clinton will talk about them, but recommends the completely wrong treatment though.

#2. Taxes

Both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are fine with continuing the progressive income tax that is currently in place. And while Trump’s plan looks like it may lower taxes, Trump’s rhetoric has been that of raising taxes, specifically on the highest income earners (which his plan proposed lowering the rate from 39.6% to 25%). When pressed on this contradiction:

Pressed on the contradiction between his latest comments on taxes and the September tax plan, Trump said that he expected his original proposal was a “a concept” and he expected that it would be changed following negotiations with Congress.

“By the time it gets negotiated, it’s going to be a different plan,” Trump told ABC. He emphasized in interviews with both ABC and in a separate interview with NBC’sMeet the Press that his priorities were lowering taxes on the middle class and businesses.

I wonder how much of it will change, seeing as how this plan is now only “a concept”.

#3. Minimum Wage

Both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton agree that the Minimum Wage should be raised. And for Trump, this is troubling, because he has flip-flopped on this issue a lot, even saying today (May 9th) that the Federal Minimum Wage should now be eliminated. Someone needs to make up their damn mind and stay there.

#4. Foreign Policy Advisors

Both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump have foreign policy advisors from the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), which has been behind the neo-conservative, interventionist foreign policy the country has had for a very, VERY long time. He has met with them, and talked with the group’s head as well. Notice that the non-interventionists have not been involved with CFR.

#5. Tariffs

Both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump want to impose new tariffs against Chinese Imports. Their rhetoric on currency manipulation is actually quite the same, making one wonder where they get it from.


Could I go on? Probably. But, these are just a few of the similarities between the Donald and Hillary. Both of these two’s supporters will vehemently deny any of this, and will probably bring up something about the mainstream media, or you being an idiot who is brainwashed and doesn’t know the truth. That, however, is wrong, and these people need to realize that the candidates they support really aren’t that different.

My Thoughts On Bernie Sanders: Racial Justice – Economic Violence

20150814_123247000_iOSI’m sharing my thoughts on Bernie Sanders, and his platform is something I have a found a lot I can agree with. Today, I’m going through his Economic Violence plank in his Racial Justice platform. Going through it, there’s a lot of stuff I know I’m going to have a lot of fun with, but overall, I see a lot of bad ideas, and a lot of “free stuff”.

Let’s dive in, shall we?

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Do You Really Have A Right To Free Healthcare?

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Do people have the right to free healthcare? That is a question that some on the political left, mostly coming from the camps of Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, would say yes. If you’re coming from reality though, then you’d say no. The arguements are being waged back and forth these days, and this topic seems to be picking up steam. Obamacare has been predicted by many on the right to end in socialized healthcare, where it basically is free. Vermont, the state that Senator Sanders represents, was moving for a socialized system, but dropped plans earlier this year.

S0, do people have a right to free healthcare? First off, let’s answer this: is it a natural right? Natural rights were explained by Locke to be Life, Liberty, and Property. Many liberals try to claim that free healthcare falls under the Right to Life, and is thus a natural right. This would be wrong.

Free healthcare is a “positive” right. In order for this “right” to be fulfilled, others people must provide for the people claiming this right. In the case of “free healthcare”, the doctors and physicians and nurses providing the services would be forced to do it for those who were seeking care. This kind of “right” isn’t really possible, and are not compatible with real (aka negative) rights.

Healthcare is a good. We need to make this clear. Bill Flax, writing for RealClearMarkets, writes:

We don’t have a right to good health. We do have a right to live how best we know to improve our health, but we didn’t pop out of the womb with a divine guaranty of ease and comfort. Nor can the state offer such.

One person’s misfortune never constitutes society’s obligation. A problem aggravated by social programs is the entitlement attitudes they engender. That government somehow bears responsibility to remove the pain and hardship from life. Unfortunately, Americans have grown inured to statist “solutions” and now flock to politicians who promise Utopian fantasies.
Politicians may transform luxuries like advanced medical care into rights, but they can’t make healthcare free. They can filter it through an all powerful bureaucracy and disguise its high costs, but government cannot guaranty one’s treatment without confiscating their citizens’ property.
That last paragraph holds an important line. “…government cannot guaranty one’s treatment without confiscating their citizens’ property.” If you have the natural right to property, then to have the “right to free healthcare”, the society must be willing to give up it’s natural right to property. Only one of these two are natural, and since one is a positive right, depending on a certain group of people to sell their labor at lower prices than they would in a free market, and another group possibly including them to give up their natural right to property, the likelyhood of a “right to free healthcare” happening won’t come at a good price to many of the people in that society, and would not make for a good cost-benefit analysis.
What would be the costs to go to “free healthcare”? Since nothing in reality is really free, as everything has a cost to it, the costs here would likely be high. Speaking as a future dental student myself, the costs for me to become a doctor now are pretty high. I would need:
  • Undergraduate college
  • Graduate college
  • Dental school
  • Internship + Residency
  • Certification

These alone, are going to wind up being tens of thousands of dollars. I would know. My tuition for college as it is is 5 digits. And it’s easier now to get extra money in the form of scholarships and private grants and loans than later down the road, unless you’ve got really good credit. By the end of this road, I’m probably going to be in a bit of debt. I’m going to need to pay this all off eventually, and pushing these off won’t help. And I cannot forget Continuing Education, as I’d still be bound to doing that to keep my certification.

What the “free healthcare” would bring about is a system that basically tells doctors and physicians what they do with the human capital they acquired in medical school, and post-secondary training. It’s basically letting the controllers of that system, most likely government, control what procedures are done, by who, and to whom. Doctors and physicians, in essence, become servants of the state. They become slaves, and that’s not what I’m going to school for.
Many liberals will again make the call for basic minimum access to healthcare. Beyond again conscripting doctors and physicians (limited), this will still do them little good, and the costs for these operations will be passed onto the other patients that the doctors care for, and thus, their prices will probably rise, causing some to not be able to afford the care they had, and move onto the basic care that screwed them in the first place. These types of programs, at their core, mean to simply bring people down. Liberals will try to argue against this, but a look at LBJ’s Great Society programs will show this.
So, to wrap this up; do you have a right to healthcare, or free healthcare? No, not at all. You have the right to life, as that is a natural right, but that means that people have the control of their own lives. They cannot, under this, force someone to do something for them without their consent, or giving something to them of equivalent value (like money). Free healthcare is something that would only make things worse, as prices would only continue to go up, due to government price controls further hampering the market forces that already represent consumer demand and supply. Healthcare is something Americans need to take back, not only from the hands of government, but also from the hands of their employers too. It must be made personal again, and most importantly, we must lift the mandate that all must have insurance. Households can only afford so much, and making them pay much more for a service they didn’t have but also couldn’t afford before, doesn’t help them. It only worsens their conditions.